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Just one of those no shit moments of, I said it first! :

 

 Just over 6 thousand years ago, in Caucasus region of western Azerbaijan near de border of Georgia, not far from tiblisi, 3 young children, were buried in the Mentesh Tepe, in Pits, in the shulaveri-shomu culture, sideways in a contracted position, (I figure this after reading paper ....Lyonnet_etal2015QI.pdf).

* Lyonnet  et al - Mentesh Tepe, an early settlement of the Shomu-Shulaveri Culture in Azerbaijan

 

 

  B . Just over 5 thousand years ago, In Iberia region of south Portugal, near the border of Spain, no far from Lisbon, 3 young Children were buried in Perdigoes site, in Pits, in the pre culture milieu of the bell beakers culture, sideways in a contracted position (I figure this after reading paper A. silva et al)

  

A silva et al -Late Neolithic Pit Burials from perdigões enclosure (Portugal): Preliminary results...

 

 now... 

Of the latter 3 children in Portugal, found in Pit7, one was Mtdna H , meaning is mom was most likely a local girl  since those Haplogroup H girls had been in Iberia for very long time, but… wait for it, wait for it… the second and third DNA were Mtdna U4 and U5. - U4 and U5 are from the southern Russia (Siberia) where actually and funny enough the oldest mutations of R1b (M343) originate something like 16,000 Years ago. We know that, for instance, in Scandinavia where its found in highest percentage in Europe they only show up much later with R1b of bell beaker… see, see. What the hell where they doing in the most southern western part of Europe so early? – They came with the leftovers of the Shulaveri Shomu R1b (M269). Bet you all if and when they figure these boys Y-Dna haplogroup it will be all if not most… R1b!

 

And also I bet you all that, when (I think Lyonnet sent samples for France for analysis) those 3 children from Mentesh Tepe Dna analysis comes out we will find the same HP U4 and U5… and if any Chr Y-dna comes out it will be R1b, all of them. 

 

No shit sherlock!

 

 Nota:Não quero de todo transformar isto num blog de antropologia, que nem é a minha praia pese embora o gosto, mas quero que fique escrito, para a posteriedade.  Quem não se interessar por estes temas ignore e siga em frente, ignorando estes posts. Ainda vou colocar mais uns 2 ou 3 antes de largar o tema. Aliás escrevi em Inglês porque estou a ter hits vindo de fora…. E para que fique escrito e claro o que é cintilante e obvio para mim.

 

 

 

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1 comentário

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De Maju a 12.01.2016 às 12:31

U4 and U5 are NOT "steppe lineages", they are actually both found in Epipaleolithic Portugal (Chandler 2005) and maybe also in Taforalt (→ http://forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.com/p/ancient-mtdna-maps-of-europe.html). U5 is widespread in all Paleolithic Europe, while U4 is more rare but still found at the Baltic and in Portugal.

The crouched position, not to mention the pits (i.e. holes in the ground, the most basic and common type of burial ever), are mainstrean in Neolithic Europe (but crouched burials are also found in Magdalenian and Epi-Magdalenian contexts). So the only thing in common seems to be that three children were buried in both sites.

Now, please, tell me: is there any other connection such as similar concept for the site (Perdigoes' characteristic curved zig-zag ditch, dolmen burials to the NE)? I'm betting that nope, else you'd mention them. So beyond the, admittedly curious, coincidence that of having three children buried, what other connection there is? None.

Notice please that Georgia is not dominated in any way by Y-DNA R1b (G instead) and that rumors about this haplogroup originating in the Caucasus are unfounded, based only on shallow looks at Armenian raw diversity, but Armenians have many different terminal branches of R1b, some Asian, others European, much as Brazilians have more Y-DNA diversity than Portuguese just because they have very diverse origins, but concluding that Portuguese originated in Brazil out of that would be wrong and a careful look at detailed phylogeny would also show that error. R1b surely originated in West Asia, somewhere between Turkey and Jordan most likely, but this is too deep in time. That original West Asian R1b produced a number of sub-branches of which we are only interested in R1b-S116/P312. This one seems to me originated in South France (see: http://forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.com/2016/01/basque-r1b-df27.html).

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